Tête-à-Tête-Tête

How about catergorizing all of these posts under Baseball Jadarm. I am trying to memorize huge chunks of it so I can talk shit with my baseball loving friends and they will think I know what I am talking about.

Also, that way when Ricky or LM or Davey or Dave or Kim or Bryan or Bill or Mike or even Smijer chime in and tells you that you don’t know what you are talking about I can add that to my storehouse of knowledge and really impress my friends!

I am trying to broaden my horizons.

ummm, …thanks!

The Braves have arguably the best 3/4 hitters in the game today…maybe even in the history of the game when you compile the numbers.

Ummm… what?

I am 100% sure I would take Ortiz/Ramirez over Jones/Teixeira.

And there are several others that are at least as good:

Utley/Howard
ARod/Abreu
Hafner/Martinez
Cabrera/Ordonez

I know… they don’t all have the righty/lefty combination, but I strongly believe that is overrated anyway.

But to say that Jones/Teixeira maybe the best 3-4 combination in the history of baseball is pretty silly. I am don’t even think that they are the best 3-4 combination in baseball today.

I know… they don’t all have the righty/lefty combination, but I strongly believe that is overrated anyway.

How is it overrated if it means deciding whether or not to leave your starting pitcher in the game in late inning pressure situations?

As a manager for the Braves…it means that I have two guys in the heart of my lineup that you cant turn around by putting in a relief pitcher.

No matter who you throw at them, righty or lefty, they are going to hit .300+ with power and will also take a walk which brings them to a .400+ OB%.

What that means is, from the 7th inning on…in tight game situations, ….you take the manager completely out of the game.

Show me another team that can do that as well as the Braves.

…with a good bullpen, which the Bravos have got, I can pitch around ANY of those duos that you have listed previously.

…try pitching around Chipper and Tex.

How is it overrated if it means deciding whether or not to leave your starting pitcher in the game in late inning pressure situations?

Well… everyone one of the players I mentioned hit pitchers well regardless of the arm they throw with.

Show me another team that can do that as well as the Braves.

The Red Sox. The Yankees.

I can pitch around ANY of those duos that you have listed previously.

Ha… if you say so. Others wouldn’t agree.

And more… Tex has only had a .400 OBP in one season of his career. He has a .371 career OBP.

By the way… Manny Ramirez has a better OPS against LHP and RHP than Chipper. And Ortiz has a significantly better OPS against RHP than Tex, and Tex has a better OPS against LHP than Ortiz. So that is a push.

Sorry… but Tex/Chipper simply don’t match up to Rameriz and Ortiz.

The Braves have arguably the best 3/4 hitters in the game today…maybe even in the history of the game when you compile the numbers.

No. Sorry, that’s too much “homerism” to ignore.

That particular title belongs to Ruth and Gehrig, with second place being far, far, far away. Chipper/Tex aren’t even the best 3/4 in their own division (Utley/Howard, followed by Beltran/Wright). In the 70s you had Lynn/Rice (and Foster/Bench and Garvey/Baker and Schmidt/Luzinski), the 80s you had the bash brothers (and Ripken/Murray), the 90s you had Walker/Bichette (and Helton and Burks and Castilla), now you can have A-Rod and, well, pretty much anyone you want because when you combine their numbers with A-Rod’s, they’re phenomenal. Looking at the numbers, it’s not feasible to make the argument that Chipper/Tex are in the top 20 in baseball history. Not even the best in team history (Aaron/Matthews).

Didnt the Bash Brothers consist of Canseco and McGwire?

“Hey Waxman…!”

…oh, …nevermind.

I love talking baseball with people that actually know what the hell they are talking about.

There are a lot of things to take into consideration here…there are some good comparisons and a few lame ones as well.

First of all, Ruth/Gehrig…I dont think you can compare eras…You are talking about a time when the Babe hit more HR’s by himself than any other single team in the game and he also has some of the greatest pitching numbers ever achieved in World Series competition.

The competition wasnt then what it is today, the training isnt what it is today. Put the Babe in a 2008′ uni and see how well he pitches, see how well he hits…if he has trouble acclimating himself then he should just give Brian McNamee a call.

the 90s you had Walker/Bichette (and Helton and Burks and Castilla)

With the exception of Larry Walker, …the rest of these guys couldnt do ANYTHING at sea level…Playing in Denver MADE these guys.

Ripken/Murray:

Chipper will definately pass Eddie Murray as the 2nd best switch hitter in the history of the game…and Tex may pass Chipper before its over and done with.

Ripken changed the game at SS…but would you really trade a 3/4 spot with Chipper and Tex for Ripken and Murray?

I wouldnt.

You have to factor in, the ballpark they are playing in, who is getting on base before these guys (because that determines what you see at the plate), and who is hitting after you (because, *ahem*, that determines what you see at the plate)

…Can we all now agree that the DH should be abolished?

Are there any purists left?

Utley/Howard:

Utley: .340 vs RHP .318 vs LHP…Chase falls short of Chipper in HR’s, avg. and walks.

Howard: Ryan hit a lot of HRs…but he also struck out 200x last year. If I have good pitching I can pitch around a guy like that 80% of the time…and he also hit at a .268 clip…an all or nothing guy.

Chipper/Teixeira:

Chipper Jones finished the season batting .337…w/ 29 HR’s and 102 RBI and only played in “134″ games.

He put those numbers up while missing a whole month of a 6 month season…and, btw, he also put up the best fielding percentage of ANY 3rd baseman in the NL but still didnt win the Gold Glove…David Wright must love playing in such a big market…it serves him well.

Tex? Well, hell, …all he did after arriving in Atlanta was hit at a .317 clip with 17 HR’s and 56 RBI in a whole 54 games played…and, btw, he also brought a few Gold Gloves with him.

Tex: .303 vs RHP / .342 vs LHP
Chipper: .378 vs RHP / .274 vs LHP (actually an anomaly, because for his career Chipper has hit for a higher avg. against LHP)

Wright/Beltran:

Wright: He hit 12 points lower than Chipper did and hit one more HR and 5 more RBI’s than Chipper did and played an ENTIRE MONTH longer than Chipper did.

Close but no cigar.

Beltran: He hit .276 last season…and .265 vs RHP.

Ortiz/Ramirez:

Ortiz: I like Big Pappy…all he did last year was hit at a .332 clip…He’s a great hitter but doesnt know what the leather is for.

Ramirez: He hit .296 last year w/ only 20 HR’s, …an off year for him…he also hit .279 against RHP…I can pitch around him…and also, he’s a great hitter but doesnt know what the leather is for.

Arod/Anyone:

Arod hit .272 vs LHP…I can pitch around him too…especially if we are in the post-season.

Folks, I am not talking about the Braves’ current 3/4 hitters being the greatest power hitters ever…nor am I saying that they have the greatest average ever…what I am saying is there are no weaknesses.

I dare anyone to deny the fact that these two guys are possibly among the top 3 switch hitters to EVER play the game, they both hit for average and power from both sides of the plate, and they also know how to use the leather.

(again…Can we abolish the DH?)

You cant pitch around them.

…and if you do…Frenchy is waiting on you!

No. Sorry, that’s too much “homerism” to ignore.

Doh!

Ortiz: I like Big Pappy…all he did last year was hit at a .332 clip…He’s a great hitter but doesnt know what the leather is for.

Ramirez: He hit .296 last year w/ only 20 HR’s, …an off year for him…he also hit .279 against RHP…I can pitch around him…and also, he’s a great hitter but doesnt know what the leather is for.

Keep in mind that the glove work has no meaning in this conversation…Manny/Papi gives the best competition.

I think Beltran/Wright is a little overrated..

You are correct in saying that…no, the glove work is not in question…but, being lost in my own vanity, I just couldnt help bringing it up.

My whole point is the fact that the Braves might just have two of the top three switch hitters in the history of the game hitting in the 3/4 spots of the lineup.

…Its a no-brainer!

My whole point is the fact that the Braves might just have two of the top three switch hitters in the history of the game hitting in the 3/4 spots of the lineup.

No it wasn’t. Your point was that they were the best 3/4 combination in baseball, and maybe in history. You justified that by saying that they were switch hitters.

And since when is batting average relevant to the discussion? Batting average is one of the most overrated stats in baseball.

And I am not sure about your assertion that Chipper/Tex as 2 of the top 3 switch hitters of all time. I will have to think about that a bit more. First of all, Tex is WAY too young to be included in such a conversation. He has only played 5 seasons. Second, I am not sure how you can say in one place that you cannot compare eras, and then try to do it by saying that Tex/Chipper are the best of all time. Third, Pete Rose might not be too happy that you are saying that Tex is better than he was.

Yeah, you need to go over how “all time” doesn’t include players that played in the past and how far back the past is allowed to go.

Wright: He hit 12 points lower than Chipper did and hit one more HR and 5 more RBI’s than Chipper did and played an ENTIRE MONTH longer than Chipper did.

Close but no cigar.

Wright is a HUGE threat on the basepaths.

Beltran: He hit .276 last season…and .265 vs RHP.

Again, Beltran is a 5 tool player. There’s a reason Chipper & Tex aren’t playing CF and stealing 30 bases per season.

There’s a reason Chipper & Tex aren’t playing CF

Again… I thought we were talking about offense. Not sure why their defensive positions matter.

I was noting ’speed’.

Lets seriously do some comparisons:

Ortiz vs. Chipper (career):
Vs. LHP: 985 vs. 968
Vs. RHP: 839 vs. 898
Overall: 943 vs 949
OPS+: 139 vs. 143

Chipper has the slight advantage, but it is most definitely not significant.

Ramirez vs. Tex (career):
VS. LHP: 1088 vs. 942
Vs. RHP: 972 vs. 897
Overall: 1.002 vs. 910
OPS+: 154 vs. 131

It isn’t even close.

It is also very clear that you cannot pitch around Ortiz or Ramirez simply because they hit from a certain side of the plate. Both can crush pitching, regardless of the arm it is thrown with.

And that is just one 3/4 tandem that is better than Tex/Jones. I don’t really have time to go on, but I could.

And by the way… this statement was odd:

And the freeswinging stud Francouer behind him?

Stud? Seriously? Lets take a look at some facts:

OPS+ (adjusted for ball park effects):
2006: 87
2007: 103
Career: 100
Average is 100.

OBP:
2006: .293
2007: .338
Career: .319
MLB average (2007): .336

SLUG:
2006: .449
2007: .444
Career: .463
MLB average (2007): .422

OPS:
2006: 742
2007: 782
Career: 782
MLB average (2007): 758

Jeff Francoeur is, by most tools of analysis, average. And I know no tool that would call him a “stud.”

I just dont see how two consecutive seasons of 100+ RBIs is average for a just-turned 24 year old outfielder.

Not to mention he is just dangerous up there.
He’s not a Ryan Howard or a Manny Ramirez by any degree, but damn if pitchers dont like pitching to him.

If he gets ahold of one its gone. Plus his work ethic in the offseason is impressive. He will last a lot longer in his career than Howard will.

And since when is batting average relevant to the discussion? Batting average is one of the most overrated stats in baseball.

what??

Tex is WAY too young to be included in such a conversation. He has only played 5 seasons.

exactly! He was 27 last year. When you talk about switch hitters, Mickey Mantle and Eddie Murray are the two best in history…compare the numbers. Thanks for the softball!

Third, Pete Rose might not be too happy that you are saying that Tex is better than he was.

I wonder if Pete will also tell you that he made more outs than anyone in the history of the game. I can appreciate Charlie Hustle as much as the next guy, …and I think he deserves to be in the Hall…but, cummon!

Yeah, you need to go over how “all time” doesn’t include players that played in the past and how far back the past is allowed to go.

Imagine Tex back in the 20’s and Imagine Ruth in todays’ game.

Again, Beltran is a 5 tool player. There’s a reason Chipper & Tex aren’t playing CF and stealing 30 bases per season.

I am all about speed and power…thats why I loved Bonds so much. He was the best EVER! But Tex and Chipper have been playing Gold Glove defense at the corners…Beltran is good in CF…but I have been spoiled by watching Andruw over the last decade.

Chipper has the slight advantage, but it is most definitely not significant.

…you are talking AL ball here, I am talking real baseball…

…are there no purists left?

Dave, I think you are wrong about Frenchy, watch his career and see what happens. I think he will be the face of the Braves pretty soon!

R.W. and Dave…you guys are killing me!

…but I luv it!

jadarm,
You can’t discount the Rockie bombers because of their home park while including the old Coors field of the AL in Arlington, which helped Tex immensely.

But Tex and Chipper have been playing Gold Glove defense at the corners

I’ll get a gold glove at 3B before Chipper. I mean, come on, they moved him to LF as soon as they got Vinny.

Imagine Tex back in the 20’s and Imagine Ruth in todays’ game.

Can’t do that kind of thing. You play with the hand that is dealt to you, otherwise each generation is always better than the previous. Can’t blame Christy Mathewson because the rules at the time didn’t include blacks or he committed the dastardly deed of not being born in 1979. History happened, thus we deal with it.

One thing is for sure, you cannot say something is the best “in history” if you’re not including, well, HISTORY.

By the way, look at #10 to see if I’m enough of a purist.

jadarm,
You can’t discount the Rockie bombers because of their home park while including the old Coors field of the AL in Arlington, which helped Tex immensely.

Excellent point RW!
Arlington’s park is similiar to Coors, though not as bad.

But, don’t put down Jadarm too quickly now guys…
Teix is entering what is primed to be the best year of his career. And with Chip, if he stays fully healthy…I’ll gladly take that 3-4 punch in a heartbeat, probably moreso than I would Ortiz and Manny. There is even more speed in chip/teix than there are between them, regardless of how little it is, and I just don’t see either of them lasting much longer. Papi is overweight and bound to break down, and Manny is getting old.
True, Chip is brittle and getting old as well, but even still as injury prone as he is and to put up the numbers he does is phenominal ((with the exception of ‘04, but hey, the guy still hit 30 HRs)).
I’ve never been sold on Beltran but there is also no denying David Wright.

The point Jadarm is trying to make, is that as far as back to back switch hitters go, Chip and Teix may very well possibly be one of the best in Baseball history, if not the best (seeing as you can’t exactly compare eras.)
I don’ think he’s talking about just any 3-4 punch in general as he is just comparing 3-4 switch hitting punches.

Switch hitting is a rare commodity, and most people aren’t going to be as successful with it, and the fact that the Braves have two excellent switch hitters back to back in the heart of their lineup just really says something..

I mean come on guys..you are throwing up great arguements as far as other hitters go, but…somebody compare back to back switch hitters and see what you come up with…

I just dont see how two consecutive seasons of 100+ RBIs is average for a just-turned 24 year old outfielder.

Well… being that RBI are one of the most team-dependent stats in baseball, I am not sure how it tells us that much about an individual player. Almost every individual stat shows him to be very average.

what??

Yup… you heard me. Batting average is overrated. Batting average is heavily dependent on luck, which is why you often see pretty significant fluctuation from season to season. OBP and SLUG are more accurate statistics of a players performance, and OPS, and even more OPS+ are much better metrics to measure a player’s performance.

I wonder if Pete will also tell you that he made more outs than anyone in the history of the game. I can

Come on. While that is true, it also just might be related to his very long and successful career, don’t you think? He had a career OBP of .375 (in other words, he made outs 62.5% of the time - much better than most).

Imagine Tex back in the 20’s and Imagine Ruth in todays’ game.

That is just silly. If you place ANY current hitter in the 20’s, they would dominate. Babe Ruth was the most dominating baseball player ever. He was more than head and shoulders above his competition. I can’t believe that you are even thinking about comparing Tex and Babe Ruth. Tex isn’t even among the top five hitters in the game. Babe Ruth was better than the rest of the top… combined. It simply wasn’t even close.

you are talking AL ball here, I am talking real baseball

No. I am talking baseball, just as you were. You never said anything about Tex/Chipper being the best in the NL. You said that they were the best in baseball, and maybe the best in history. It was your argument, not mine.

Dave, I think you are wrong about Frenchy, watch his career and see what happens. I think he will be the face of the Braves pretty soon!

Well… that may be true. But he sure isn’t a “stud” right now.

somebody compare back to back switch hitters and see what you come up with…

But that wasn’t his argument. Lets go back to what he wrote originally:

The Braves have arguably the best 3/4 hitters in the game today…maybe even in the history of the game when you compile the numbers.

We have given a small sampling of the “compiled numbers,” and they simply don’t support his argument.

I’ll gladly take that 3-4 punch in a heartbeat, probably moreso than I would Ortiz and Manny.

Personal preference, which I cannot change. Some fans would “gladly take” Peyton Manning while others would prefer Tom Brady. I’ll take Kathy Ireland while others prefer Angelina Jolie.

The point Jadarm is trying to make, is that as far as back to back switch hitters go, Chip and Teix may very well possibly be one of the best in Baseball history, if not the best (seeing as you can’t exactly compare eras.)

Again, what constitutes “history” to you? You’ve foregone the Yankee dynasty from the 20s & 30s, so history doesn’t mean…..history….it appears to mean “recent history, in parks that aren’t friendly to hitters, relegated only to switch hitters that bat 3 and 4 in the lineup, with a heavy reliance on OPS and average” (which truly is an overrated statistic, which is why OPS was created, after all). If that’s the case, you may be right….I haven’t researched what teams had back to back switch hitters.

Babe & Gehrig didn’t need to bat righty, though, did they? .340 and .343 says they did okay from one side of the plate.

Enjoyed it, guys.

Dave, I do strongly disagree with you with regards to the importance of batting average.

My favorite stat is just plain OB%..thats just me personally…(and people like Billy Bean). But tie that in with the batting avg. and then you put other factors into play..for instance, the hit and run option.

Purists love the hit and run…its real baseball.

Also, you have to take in other considerations, like power to the gaps, speed, and the ability to “turn” on the ball from the 7th inning on as needed.

Dave, I am guessing by your statements that you dont think too highly of Tony Gwynn, Wade Boggs, Ted Williams…etc.

RW, Its not just switch hitters in general…its switch hitters who hit for both avg, power, and OB% from both sides of the plate…

Like I said earlier, I dont think that Chipper and Tex are the greatest 3/4 power threats…not even in the game today, nor are they the greatest avg. threats …but when you take into consideration the great switch hitters in the history of the game…and then come to the conclusion that there was only one guy in the history of the game that is better than these two (Mickey Mantle)…then I dont understand why you dont understand the argument.

With a good pitching staff you look for particular weaknesses and then try to expose them.

RW, Dave…? How do you pitch around Chipper and Tex? Especially with men on base and Frenchy hitting behind them?

As far as what role the ballparks play in an atheletes’ performance? …that is a “no-brainer”.

Playing in Coors Field enhances hitters’ statistics…the ball carries further and also the pitching takes a hit…with the thin air the ball doesnt have enough time or resistance to break accordingly…giving the hitters yet another advantage.

Tex did play in Texas…hardly a fair comparison to Coors but whatever…just look what he did once he arrived in Atlanta though.

He hits well on the road as well…something Helton has never done.

d then come to the conclusion that there was only one guy in the history of the game that is better than these two (Mickey Mantle)…then I dont understand why you dont understand the argument.

If your argument is Chipper’s career, then I agree. He’s probably the one of the best switch hitters of all time. Chipper and Tex TODAY, though, aren’t as much of a threat at the plate than some other 3/4 combos, which was my original argument. I’ll put it this way: if you’re going into your fantasy draft with Chipper & Tex rated above Utley & Howard, well, let’s just say that I hope for your sake it’s a free league.

He hits well on the road as well…something Helton has never done.

??

Helton’s a career .295 hitter on the road. Tex is .271. Both are similar on most of the other areas, but Helton’s career on the road is better. Of course, Tex is in a new league, so that’ll change things. Personally, I can’t wait to see him in a Braves uni for a while.

Playing in Coors Field enhances hitters’ statistic

Not any more. The humidor effect is in full play. Google “ballpark factor” to find the best hitting parks.

Dave, I am guessing by your statements that you dont think too highly of Tony Gwynn, Wade Boggs, Ted Williams…etc.

[closed blockquote tag -smijer]

One of those names doesn’t belong. The one with 521 homers (no, I didn’t need to google that, I’m a true fan) is on another list. FYI, Ryan Howard’s career OBP is higher than Tex’s.

no, I didn’t need to google that, I’m a true fan

Are you questioning my fanhood?

This will never end will it?

I’ll put it this way: if you’re going into your fantasy draft with Chipper & Tex rated above Utley & Howard, well, let’s just say that I hope for your sake it’s a free league.

Nope, not fantasy baseball…and I feel that is exactly where this thread has actually taken us.

Helton’s a career .295 hitter on the road. Tex is .271. Both are similar on most of the other areas, but Helton’s career on the road is better.

I never said he wasnt a decent hitter, all I said was that Coors helped his numbers.

There is an almost .080 pts difference between Heltons’ home and road #’s where average is concerened. He has also hit 70+ HRs at home than compared to the road.

There is only a .030 pt difference in Texs’ road/home avg. with only 16 more HRs coming on the road…hardly a concession to the hometown stadium.

Chipper hits with a .016 differential on avg. with only 26 more HR’s coming at home.

FYI, Ryan Howard’s career OBP is higher than Tex’s.

Ryan Howard also struck out 200x last year. Not much for the hit and run option eh? He also hit .235 vs LHP…like I said, with a good bullpen or staff, I can pitch around him.

…and Utley gets almost 2x as many K’s per BB’s.

…I can keep going.

I never said he wasnt a decent hitter, all I said was that Coors helped his numbers.

Er, you typed “He hits well on the road as well…something Helton has never done.” Helton HAS done.

Ryan Howard also struck out 200x last year

An out is an out, which is why Howard is the 2nd most feared hitter at the plate in the game (A-Rod).

Not much for the hit and run option eh?

Any manager that attempted to hit and run with Ryan Howard at the plate should be fired immediately. Howard’s job is putting runs on the board or scoring them, something he does in mass quantities.

He also hit .235 vs LHP…like I said, with a good bullpen or staff, I can pitch around him.

Which is why Pat Burrell knocked in 114 last year. You don’t think NL managers have considered that approach?

Besides, in three seasons he only has a ROY & an MVP to his credit….and he hasn’t even become eligible for free agency. Best young power hitter in the game, bar none.

…and Utley gets almost 2x as many K’s per BB’s.

????
That and 50 cents will get you a copy of USA Today. Utley’s a hitter, not a walker. See: Puckett, Kirby. Seriously, your argument against these stats are that he doesn’t walk enough? Then why is it that Frenchy is the bomb, again?

Are you questioning my fanhood?

Nah, pimping my sports street cred like a rapper flashing their bullet wound.

Er, you typed “He hits well on the road as well…something Helton has never done.” Helton HAS done.

with an .080 differential….what??

Look, he used to be QB at my beloved Neyland Stadium…but I just cant swallow this. He is a good hitter…but not as good a hitter as his “stats” might suggest.

Any manager that attempted to hit and run with Ryan Howard at the plate should be fired immediately. Howard’s job is putting runs on the board or scoring them, something he does in mass quantities.

Ok then…touche’..

…However you cannot ignore the ability to put the bat on the ball in crucial situations.

That and 50 cents will get you a copy of USA Today. Utley’s a hitter, not a walker. See: Puckett, Kirby. Seriously, your argument against these stats are that he doesn’t walk enough? Then why is it that Frenchy is the bomb, again?

…then why the hell have I been paying .75 cents for MY USA Today??

…Frenchy is a bonifide star in the making…I hope you are still here commenting 10 years from now with your “smiley faces” when Frenchy is donning the SI cover yet ten more times…

…Ok, I am getting ahead of myself here…

I am a Braves fan…its very hard to be critical of what and who you love…it is, however, easy to get on the bandwagon.

Frenchy has already won his 1st Gold Glove. He has already hit 100 RBI at the tender age of 23…he is 24 now.

He is also capable of hitting .300 and 30+ HRs consistantly…in the outfield?? He wants you to run on him…that way he gets to show off his arm…the same one that he threw 96MPH fastballs in High School with.

An out is an out, which is why Howard is the 2nd most feared hitter at the plate in the game (A-Rod).

…RW, with runners on base, …are you more scared of the HR that will happen with Howard in approximately 45 times out of 550 ABs or are you worried about the base hit, or the one to the gap, approximately 200 times out of 550 ABs?

…RW, with runners on base, …are you more scared of the HR that will happen with Howard in approximately 45 times out of 550 ABs or are you worried about the base hit, or the one to the gap, approximately 200 times out of 550 ABs?

Howard has an MVP trophy on his mantle for just that reason. Remember, you were going to pitch around him (apparently, you were a bit scared, too). With runners on, ya gotta go after him.

Like Ralph Kiner said, singles hitters drive Fords, homerun hitters drive cadillacs.

+BTW, ~200/550 is a .360+ hitter and unless Ty Cobb has been reincarnated, there ain’t no more of them around. The guy you described was Mark Grace or Wally Joyner. I’ll take Howard, thankyouverymuch.

And……I’m spent.

RW wins!!